Category Archives: faithful and discreet slave

TYPES AND ANTITYPES: Transcript of discourse by David Splane at October 2014 Annual Meeting

The 2014 Annual Meeting Program video can be found on tv.jw.org (currently found under Programs and Events). The following speech can be found about the 2 hour and 8 minute mark in the video. It ends at about the 2 hour and 25 minute mark.

“David Splane of the Governing Body will speak to us on the theme: ‘Types and Antitypes.’” 

IT’S NOT FUNNY IF YOU HAVE TO “SPLANE” IT 

The following is an unofficial transcript of that talk. It is very informative to note the differences between this, the original talk, and the Watchtower article that was derived from it. Our site’s commentary on the March 15, 2015 Watchtower article is found here.

Transcript begins:

________________________________________________

Let’s get right into our subject: types and antitypes.

Now, years ago, our publications often applied certain Bible accounts and certain bible characters as “types” of something greater. But you’ve noticed that, in recent years, that is seldom done, and the purpose of this talk is to explain why.

First of all what is a type and what is an antitype? Well, the Watchtower of September 15, 1950 defined them this way. It said:

“A type is a representation of something that will come to pass at a future time. The antitype is the reality of the thing which the type represents.”

So that is the definition that was given by The Watchtower. And we might add that Jehovah is usually involved in designing the type.

Now, take the tabernacle. Jehovah was very clear about the construction of the tabernacle: what materials were to be used, the dimensions and so forth. Why? Well, apparently because he had designed the tabernacle to be a type of something greater: his great spiritual temple. And the temple was the antitype.

The sacrifices on the Day of Atonement. Jehovah was very careful about how events on the Day of Atonement were to unfold. And again, we have to realize that something was going to have to picture or foreshadow the perfect sacrifice of Jesus Christ. So, the sacrifice on the Day of Atonement, the type, and the perfect sacrifice of Christ, the antitype.

Now consider another example. When the disobedient Israelites in the wilderness were bitten by poisonous snakes, Moses is told by Jehovah to fashion a copper serpent and to place that serpent on a pole. Now that was a type. Now Jesus explains what it was a type of. Let’s turn to John chapter 3, John chapter 3 and verses 14 and 15. John 3: 14 and 15 If you are using an iPad, I’ll give you a chance to catch up. [Laughter] I couldn’t resist. “And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, so that everyone believing in him may have everlasting life.” Now, would anyone doubt that this is a type? Of course not. Because Jesus said it was.

Well notice that in both these examples, the tabernacle and the copper serpent, Jehovah was involved. He designed the type so that it would fit the antitype. He told Moses, for example to fashion a copper serpent and put it, not on a rock, but on a stake. And of course the tabernacle prefiguring the great spiritual temple.

And from the apostle Paul we learn even more about types and antitypes. For example, Paul, in Hebrews: Isaiah and his 2 sons represent Jesus, and the anointed. He also explains that Moses, the mediator of the Law covenant, represents Christ the mediator of the new covenant. And we learn from the letter to the Galatians that Abraham’s relationship with Sarah and Hagar, represents Jehovah’s relationship with the nation of Israel, and with the heavenly part of his organization. Type and antitype.

Now we know that these were genuine types because, the word of God says they are. But here is the question:

Who is to decide if a person or an event is a type if the word of God doesn’t say anything about it? Who is qualified to do that? Our answer? We can do no better than to quote our beloved brother, Albert Schroeder, who said:

“We need to exercise great care when applying accounts in the Hebrew Scriptures as prophetic patterns, or types, if these are accounts are not applied in the Scriptures themselves.”

Wasn’t that a beautiful statement? We agree with it.

Now the study of types and antitypes is not unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses. During the past 2,000 years, Catholic and Jewish scholars have made quite a diligent study of types and antitypes. In fact, there is even a name for the study. They call it “typology.”

The first century Jewish scholar, Philo of Alexandria, for example, suggested that the serpent in the garden of Eden, the tree of knowledge and the cherubs that were guarding the entrance to the garden were all typical of something greater.

And then describing the teachings of such early writers as Origen, Ambrose and Jerome, the International Standard Bible Encyclopedia says this:

“They sought for types and of course found them, in every incident and event, however trivial, recorded in Scripture. Even the most simple and commonplace circumstance was thought to conceal within itself a hidden truth. Even in the number of fish caught by the disciples when the risen Savior appeared to them,” he says, “How much some have tried to make of that number:, 153 .”

One scholar made much of Jacob’s purchase of Esau’s birthright with a bowl of red stew. Very significant that the stew was red. To him, the red stew pictured the red blood of Christ. The inheritance pictured the heavenly inheritance. It’s all… By that reasoning, Jacob pictures Jesus, Esau’s birthright pictures the heavenly inheritance, and the red stew pictures Jesus’ precious blood.

Now on the surface that might sound plausible to some, until you think about it. When you think about it you see three problems. First of all, Jehovah didn’t design the type. Jehovah did not tell Esau to sell his birthright. Selling his birthright was wrong, and Jehovah never tells us to do something that’s wrong. Second, who ate the stew? Esau did. So are we to conclude that, by giving up his inheritance, Esau put himself in line for the ransom sacrifice of Jesus Christ? That doesn’t make any sense. And most importantly, nowhere in Scripture do we read that the event was a type.

Now the study of types and antitypes was not only common among Catholic and Jewish scholars, but were very prominent among Protestant scholars as well. The Puritans, like Edward Taylor, applied many Bible events to themselves. The Baptists and Congregationalists did likewise. So it’s not surprising that the early Bible Students, who generally belonged to these groups were also really fond of types.

And as many of us have been. Many of us have remembered happy moments at the congregation book study studying all about types and antitypes. And it’s true that the study of types could be thrilling!

So now here’s a question. If the study of a certain subject make chills run up and down your spine, could it possibly be mistaken? And the answer is yes.

The case of brother Arch W. Smith is an example. In 1886, Brother Russell published a book that contained a chart linking the ages of mankind to the Great Pyramid of Egypt. Now that pyramid was called by the Bible Students, the “Bible in stone.” They loved the study of the Pyramid. In fact, if you have seen pictures of Brother Russell’s grave, you’ve noticed that there was a pyramid nearby. And that’s because the Bible Students believed very much in the Great Pyramid of Egypt, and some became very engrossed, in measuring certain rooms and certain features of the pyramid and to try to determine, for example, how long they had to wait before they went to heaven, and so on.

And so one who was just thrilled by the study of types was Arch W. Smith. It was a hobby of his, he loved it. In fact he gave a lot of prayerful thought to the dimension of the pyramid, and from time to time he would write in to Bethel and let them know what his findings were, to support the idea that the Great Pyramid had a place in Jehovah’s purpose. He loved it!

But when The Watchtower of 1928 came out and said that Jehovah doesn’t need a stone monument built by pagans to accomplish his purpose, Brother Smith accepted it. He let reason win out over emotion.

Well, in recent years the trend in our publications has been to look for the practical application of Bible events, and not for types where the Scriptures themselves do not clearly identify them as such. We simply cannot go beyond what is written. Now there’s a real advantage in looking for the practical application of Bible accounts, rather than confining certain applications to one class: “This applies only to the anointed.” “This applies only to the other sheep.”

Let’s just see why. Turn to Romans chapter 15 and verse 4. Now remember that Paul is writing to his anointed brothers here. Romans chapter 15 and verse 4. And he says, “For all the things that were written beforehand” . . . Well what things? The Hebrew Scriptures obviously. . . “were written for our instruction so that through our endurance, that through the comfort of the Scriptures, that we might have hope.” What is Paul telling the anointed? He’s telling them that you can learn from these accounts in the Hebrew Scriptures. You can apply principles of the Hebrew Scriptures to yourselves.

Let’s consider an example: Now soon after his conversion, Paul is preaching in the city of Damascus. The Jews are furious and they try to kill him. So anointed disciples take Paul and they lower him down the city wall in a basket. Is it possible that some of those anointed ones they thought of Rahab? Who helped the two spies escape from Jericho by a similar method? Would anyone say to them, “You can’t apply that to yourselves…Rahab pictures the other sheep, you are of the anointed?” No! They could apply the lessons of that account to themselves.

Now let’s consider another example, a modern one. In the Song of Solomon we read of a chaste young virgin who falls desperately in love with a poor shepherd boy. Solomon, who incidentally was still an inspired Bible writer at the time, but he’s a very wealthy man, he tries to lure her away but he’s unable to do so. Now suppose that in a certain congregation there’s a sweet young sister, who falls head over heels for a poor pioneer brother, who’s a real spiritual man but he doesn’t have a penny to his name. Now her friends encourage her to marry a wealthy brother, who is very rich but he doesn’t have a lot of time to spend on spiritual things. The sister remains firm. They say, you wouldn’t have to work! You can pioneer. She says no my love is for that pioneer boy. Would anyone say to her, the Song of Solomon doesn’t apply to you because you’re of the other sheep, not of the anointed?

You see how practical it is to take these Bible accounts and really apply them to the everyday life of people.

What about others of the other sheep today? In this audience there are modern-day Nehemiahs who are spurring the building programs we have. Wonderful young Timothys, graduates of our Bible schools, warmhearted Tabitha’s, hospitable Lydias. And don’t we find exceptional young Circuit Overseers who are like Elihu in giving wise counsel to elders who are much older. And don’t many Christian young women remind us of dear Rebekah who was willing to follow her husband to a distant land for the accomplishment of Jehovah’s purpose?

We deeply appreciate the spiritual heritage that was passed on to us by the early Bible Students. In harmony with Zechariah chapter 4 and verse 10: “We do not despise the day of small things.” However the light does get brighter. And we feel that we must follow the light, wherever it leads us. Our love should be for the truth and not for a particular doctrine or teaching.

Well how would you sum this talk in a few words?

The wrong answer is, “We don’t believe in types and antitypes any more.” We do! We certainly do. Where the scriptures identify them as such, we embrace them. But where the Bible is silent, we must be silent.

Now in the three talks that follow there are going to be important clarifications in our beliefs.

Perhaps a certain adjustment will touch a spiritual nerve, make us rethink a cherished teaching. Our love for Jehovah and the truth will make us receive this information gladly and with open hearts.

Often today we hear brothers say, we’re having a hard time keeping up with the celestial chariot. So are we. So are the Governing Body. We’re not driving the chariot. Jehovah is driving the chariot and we’re running just as fast as you are, trying to keep up. So let’s all do our best to keep up with it. And let us thank Jehovah for continuing to deal with us. And for continuing to provide nourishing spiritual food.

________end of transcript________

Personal notes:

  • In the commentary on the Watchtower article based on this talk ( http://ad1914.com/2015/01/26/2107/ ) we pointed out a few items of interest:

    First of all, the idea is given that these “type-antitype” explanations have already been phased out to some extent over the past few years, but with no official explanation until now.

    The talk mentions that some legitimate examples of “type/antitype” included the tabernacle (shadows), the sacrifices, Abraham’s wife and mistress, and the snake on a pole. The 3/15/2015 Watchtower article replaced the snake on a pole with the sign of Jonah.

    It’s pointed out that this “typology” stuff has had a long history among a lot of religions, Jewish, Catholic and Protestant. (And some ridiculously bad examples are mentioned as if they were more ridiculous than Watch Tower examples.)

    The logic behind using the Rahab and Shulamite examples is twisted and anachronistic. As far as Paul’s companions knew, there never was and never would be an incorrectly explained “other sheep” class represented by Rahab. And what sister says, “The reason I am choosing the broke pioneer over the rich brother because the Song of Solomon applies to me.” In Splane’s illustration, she never actually says that, but Splane indicates that there is some danger that the sister is going to hear an argument meant to to push her into the arms of the rich brother simply because she is not “anointed” — as if only “anointed” sisters should be able to choose the poor penniless pioneer.

    But the speech says, basically, that the Watch Tower teachings took this too far. It says it will only be used from now on if the Bible tells us specifically that it is a “type.” This seems commendable.

    The problem is that this new guideline is watered down considerably in the March 15, 2015 Watchtower article based on this talk. It seems very likely that between the Annual Meeting and the end of the 2014, someone noticed that following the words of this talk would completely ruin the two most important unique doctrines of JWs today:

    1. That the Kingdom of the pagan, Gentile, violent, insane, Jew-killing Nebuchadnezzar was a “type” of God’s non-Gentile Kingdom through Christ Jesus, the perfect Prince of Peace, as represented by the Jewish Davidic/Messianic Kingdom at Jerusalem.

    2. That the “faithful and discreet slave” in Matthew 24:45 was a “type” of the Governing Body.

    Also, found it “funny” how Splane treats the old Pyramid scheme, promoted in the Watch Tower publications from the 1880’s to the 1920’s.

    The March 15, 2015 article tries to keep the idea of being once “thrilled” by these explanations in the past as a good thing. Splane had used it to show that being thrilled doesn’t always mean it was right.

Organization Claims It “Sucks…the Breasts of Kings” by “Milking” Contributors

[If this post seems off-topic, it’s here because it shows just how illogical Watchtower doctrine can get. There are those who would claim that 1914 might be right because even if it doesn’t make sense, it’s only one part of an entire set of doctrines that are Bible-based and all those doctrines are interconnected. By commenting on other doctrines that are clearly non-sensible, we hope to disabuse those who follow any doctrines without due consideration to truth, logic and Biblical precedent.]

The Watch Tower claims to suck the breasts of kings. And it also claims — seriously — to be “milking” fellow JWs who voluntarily contribute.

Nope. Not kidding at all.

And this isn’t from one of those old absurd doctrines that you can find on almost every page of the “The Finished Mystery” or “Pyramid Schemes for Dummies”  (aka, “The Divine Plan of the Ages”).

No, this is current teaching, It’s in the July 1, 2002 Watchtower (and the book, Isaiah’s Prophecy, too.).

A little background: A comment came to the site a couple days ago about how, in the midst of all the stated “urgency” surrounding 1975, the Watch Tower Society was beginning to take on more and more  long-term projects.  Even now, projects in Warwick, NY for example, are scheduled for many years out into the future. This has even struck a lot of JWs as contradictory, and the Society sometimes has directed answers toward those raised eyebrows, explaining how it expects to continue operating even into the new system.

However, it turns out that these building projects –even the  contributions of money that Jehovah’s Witnesses are giving to the Society– this is all proof that God’s organization is “sucking the breasts of kings.” 

The idea behind the “milk” theme, here, is much older, but we’ll start in 1985. The Watchtower of March 1, 1985 contains material incorporated later into the “Isaiah’s Prophecy” book.

(Isaiah 60:1-4) “Arise, O woman, shed light,…..From far away your sons keep coming, And your daughters being supported on the hip.

Then Isa. 60: 14-16 says:

14 The sons of those who oppressed you will come and bow down before you;…And they will have to call you …Zion…  16 And you will actually suck the milk of nations, and the breast of kings you will suck;

It’s explained by saying that the earthly part of God’s organization makes practical use of communication, transport and printing facilities.

*** w85 3/1 p. 15 par. 14 ***
“In a figurative way the earthly representatives of God’s organization thus use all available resources in advancing true worship. They make practical use of modern facilities of communication, transport, and printing to get the good news preached. Jehovah’s watchcare and guidance have been with Jehovah’s Witnesses in this work.”

You might wonder about that claim of “Jehovah’s watchcare and guidance” if you worked at Brooklyn Bethel while they threw away literally millions of dollars on outdated press technology. (See Randall Watters experience.)  [Editor’s note: My roommate at Bethel and one of my best friends, who roomed a couple doors down from us, were both called to Bethel to work in the new Computer Department. Frustrations ran high in that department, and the primary complaint was the many millions of dollars lost because uneducated and untrained “Bethel Elders” in charge, claimed they should override the decisions of IBM consultants regarding computer projects, due to their own higher seniority and “spiritual qualifications.”]

The Isaiah’s Prophecy book updated the list of “milk products” to include modern technology for translation of books and Bibles:

*** ip-2 chap. 21 p. 316 par. 21 ***
His people have sucked “the milk of nations,” using resources from the nations for the advancement of true worship. For example, wise use of modern technology has made possible the translation and publication of Bibles and Bible literature in hundreds of languages.

Then the July 1, 2002 Watchtower pushes this idea almost to point of “lactose intolerance” by adding just one more milk product to the list:

*** w02 7/1 p. 16 par. 6  ***
How does Zion feed on “the milk of nations” and suck “the breast of kings”? In that anointed Christians and their “other sheep” companions use valuable resources from the nations in order to advance pure worship. Freely given financial contributions help to make possible a great international preaching and teaching work.

The Watch Tower interpretation schema for Hebrew prophecies is certainly strange, but there is often a perceptible method to its madness. In the above quoted articles and books, however, the usual methods become more tangled than ever. We don’t need to take the space to go into it all of it here, but the Watchtower makes a complete mess of it: Even though it’s the “mother” in heaven (Zion, mother, heavenly Jerusalem) who is sucking, the article (1985) uses words apparently designed to divert attention to the idea the “sons and daughters” sucking, to move this application from God’s heavenly organization in this case to God’s earthly organization. Those ambiguous words evidently triggered the need for a clarification in a “Questions from Readers” four months later. In 2002, they clumsily add the great crowd into the mix as a contributing conduit of milk from those nations. But the kings of those nations in the same (1985 article) are pagan kings who “aptly” represent Jehovah and Jesus, and might even “moreover” represent the prospective anointed kings on earth, who serve with “foreigners” from nations all around, which picture the “great crowd” while those nations –at the same time– also picture Babylon the Great in the same chapter.

The Watch Tower Society has gotten much better at printing without losing millions of dollars of hard-earned donations from the “great crowd” (At least 99.99% anyway). And the improvements in their website indicate initially expensive, but strategically wiser decisions about technology. So it’s ironic, that no matter how good they get, it was somehow prophesied that they would still “suck….the breasts of kings.” (Isa 60:14, NWT, 1984)

RESOURCES: Books, Web Sites, Blogs, Forums, Videos – NEW! UPDATED!

BOOKS

WEB SITES

FORUMS

SOCIAL

VIDEOS

BOOKS

(Books/Booklets/Tracts/Brochures/Newsletters link)

The link takes you to a long list of books. Not all are recommended for purposes of studying chronology, but will give an idea of the many types of books out there about JWs. Some of the ones most well known for studying the chronology doctrines are highlighted in that list. In addition we list some of the best ones here, in no particular order:

The Gentile Times Reconsidered

The Gentile Times Reconsidered

Carl Olof Jonsson

Available online:
http://kristenfrihet.se/english/gtr4/contents.htm
Jehovah's Witnesses: Their Claims, Doctrinal Changes, and Prophetic Speculation. What Does the Record Show?

Jehovah’s Witnesses:…Prophetic Speculation

Edmond C. Gruss

Available online: (Preview)
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=193123230X
Apocalypse Delayed: The Story of Jehovah's Witnesses

Apocalypse Delayed

M. James Penton

Available online: (Preview)

https://books.google.com/books?isbn=0802079733

Judgment Day Must Wait: Jehovah's Witnesses- A Sect Between Idealism and Deceit

Judgment Day Must Wait

Poul Bregninge

Available online: (No preview)
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=1936411237
Crisis of Conscience

Crisis of Conscience

Raymond Franz

Available online:
khazarzar.skeptik.net/books/franz01
In Search of Christian Freedom

In Search of Christian Freedom

Raymond Franz

 Avaiable online:
https://www.watchtowerlies.com/linked/in_search.pdf
The Four Presidents of the Watch Tower Society (Jehovah's Witnesses)

The Four Presidents of the Watch Tower Society

Edmond C. Gruss

 Available online: (Preview)
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=1594671311
signoflast

Sign of the Last Days – When

Carl O. Jonsson, Rud Persson

 Available online: No
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=0914675095

Of course, this is far from a complete list.

INTERNET

(Websites/Blogs/Forums/Social/Video)

It’s easy to go to Google and search on the keywords: “1914, Watchtower” or “JW 607” or “overlapping generation” and find hundreds of links to try out. Many of the sites you will also do an excellent job covering  issues related to Jehovah’s Witnesses and Watchtower-related doctrines. We won’t try to list all of them, but we will try to cover all of the best ones known for their excellent coverage of the 1914 doctrine.

For good lists of JW-related sites in general, try the links at:  ex-jw.com/web-directory   There is also a good list of links that focus on JW outreach ministries at Make Sure Ministries. We reproduce those lists on this site, here: http://ad1914.com/general-jw-related-websites-and-jw-outreach-ministry-websites/ .

The following are some of the best ones that cover the Watch Tower chronology teachings:

jwfacts.com

Excellent site for coverage of most major JW issues, not just the chronology issues, of course. The site owner and creator, Paul Grundy, has generously allowed us to use several of his articles on this site. For the complete and most up-to-date articles, they should be viewed on his own site.

http://kristenfrihet.se/english/epage.htm

This site is owned and created by Carl Olof Jonsson, and reflects the most in-depth work on all the Watch Tower’s chronology-related subjects, and several others, too.
jeffros607

https://jeffro77.wordpress.com/

Excellent coverage of the related issues surrounding the 1914 doctrine. (Not 607 only) One if the highlights of this site is the excellent response to a slickly produced, but academically dishonest site that is popular among many online JWs. (The dishonest site is at: http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/607/ but portions of it have also been copied elsewhere. Some will find this approach as a quicker approach when asked to respond to sites such as the above or http://onlytruegod.org/jwstrs/607BCE.htm or http://pastorrussell.blogspot.com/2010/08/seven-times-2520-years-607-bce-1914-ce.html
 corior

http://corior.blogspot.com/

 Many of the articles on this site, especially those from Alan Feuerbacher, present unique and extremely well-researched information. (Alan was one of the persons, along with Rud Persson and others, who worked with Carl Olof Jonsson on his research.)
 Jehovah's Witnesses

http://www.jwstudies.com/jehovah_s_witnesses.html

This site, from Doug Mason, contains much more detailed research than one might guess at first sight. He covers many subjects, and is excellent on the 1914 doctrine. Also, his interactions with the Watch Tower Society on the subject reach back to the early 1960’s.

http://e-watchman.com/?s=1914

This is a blog by someone who claims to be a prophet. Whatever one thinks of such a claim, several of his pages on the 1914 teaching are very well-written, Scripturally sound, and thought-provoking. The link opens up several related posts on a single page.
interactivbibleca

http://www.bible.ca/cgi-bin/texis/webinator/search/main.html?query=1914+Watchtower

The site is about many Christian doctrines, and contains at least 40  excellent articles on Jehovah’s Witnesses ( http://www.bible.ca/indexJws.htm ). The link provided in the middle column returns 18 good articles about the 1914 teaching.
jwb

http://www.jehovahswitnessblog.com/jw-dates/

The site is refreshingly straightforward, and well-written. About 9 excellent pages on 607 and 1914 from the main menu.
http://watchtowerdocuments.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/header-03-30-15.jpg

http://watchtowerdocuments.org/?s=1914

The link to the left will return about a half a dozen excellent articles written with the insight about the Watch Tower doctrine-makers themselves. Barbara Anderson’s combination of experience, intelligence and accuracy is what makes these articles so valuable. Additionally, the gigabytes of collected and archived documents found in the site’s library ( http://watchtowerdocuments.org/document-library/ ) provide a wealth of often unexplored information for the researcher.
freeminds

http://www.freeminds.org/history/history.htm

Randy Watters’ site is an amazing collection of information. Too big to organize. The list of articles that appear when clicking the link to the left gives some idea of the scope.

We could never expect to cover the many excellent stand-alone pages that are often part of larger sites, or even great articles on the subject that one can find on wikipedia or publications found on archive.org, etc. Here are just a few more examples, however, that you won’t want to miss:

  • https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology_of_Jehovah’s_Witnesses
  • http://www.jwstruggle.com/2012/01/a-problem-with-1914/
  • http://www.4jehovah.org/why-1914-ad-and-607-bc-are-false/
  • http://taze.co/2015/06/05/are-we-living-in-the-last-days/
  • https://ia700705.us.archive.org/26/items/JerusalemWasNotDestroyedIn607B.c/jerusalem-607.pdf
  • http://www.towerwatch.com/articles/the_1914_doctrine.htm (Jan Haugland)
  • http://jwsurvey.org/cedars-blog/the-1914-obsession-watchtower-clings-to-flawed-teaching-in-first-magazine-of-2014 (John Cedars)
  • http://www.cftf.com/1914/index.html (David Reed)
  • http://www.watchman.org/articles/jehovahs-witnesses/jehovahs-witnesses-and-the-history-of-1914/
  • http://www.sixscreensofthewatchtower.com/11914.html
  • http://www.religioustolerance.org/witness8a.htm
  • and many, many more!

FORUMS

There are many types of forums online where beliefs of all kinds are discussed, and there are gems of information in many of these.This includes answers.yahoo.com, yuku.com, beliefnet.com (read only as of October 31, and many others.

jwn

The largest of these forums is called “Jehovah’s Witnesses Discussion” (JWD) and often also called “Jehovah’s Witnesses Net” (JWN). It’s at www.jehovahs-witness.com (recently moved from .net). It’s huge, but well managed. It has been around many years, and a lot of excellent, intelligent comments have been collected. Unfortunately, they are often difficult to find again, even with an adequate search tool on the site. Over time we may try to extract some of the more interesting ideas posted there, and make them more accessible by organizing some of the links and getting permission from posters to through some organization There is also the common forum-specific problem of those high level of argumentation that often end in the dramatic removal of accounts. This has affected even the best of commenters.

SOCIAL MEDIA and VIDEOS

The best of these are usually already associated with a website or blog, but the best way to take advantage of them is to do a search on Vimeo, YouTube, Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, etc., using a combination of keywords including, 1914, JW, and Watchtower. The advantage of these tools is based on the fact that most JWs do not care about the problems with 1914. Sites like this one and many like it are too confusing. Once something gets complex, the Watch Tower doctrine wins by default, because it’s the one that can’t be seriously questioned.

Most JWs won’t give more than a few seconds of serious thought to such controversies. That gives the upper hand to the quick, pithy statement in a Twitter feed, or the title and image of a shared Facebook item or a “meme” that gets a message across in 5 seconds or less, but with an image that makes the message stick for at least a few more seconds. (Just a few Internet seconds are hard to get, and therefore very valuable.)

I’ve seen evidence of at least a quarter-million JWs who have Google+, Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram accounts for example, and at least half of them also belong to forums or follow accounts where the 1914 controversy has come up.

Keeping track of some of the available video resources is especially worthwhile because video has the ability to draw JWs into serious thought about their teachings, when many of those same persons would have studiously avoided reading anything that promoted serious thought about their teachings. Also, JWs are trained to learn passively from talks, and trained to interact with rational-sounding argument in their house-to-house or Bible study ministries when a non-JW confronts them about their beliefs. Besides a message can be conveyed before a Witness even figures out if it was from a pro-JW site or not. More video resources should be created for these reasons.

Some good videos also make use of humor, sometimes to a ridiculous extent. We don’t see this as a problem and include them below.  Some of the more serious ones have a different problem to watch out for. We’ve noticed that a much higher percentage of videos get their facts wrong when compared with persons who create written documentation and evidence. Still, these are quite useful for sharing with others who need some extra background about the problems and controversies, but won’t read about it.

JW’s- Your New Tool to Explain 1914

JW.ORG ~ 1914 Is A Lie Covering Up A Huge Mistake!

1914 and the Elders Wife [JW.org]

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